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Trade Deadline Open Thread: Dotel-Davies is Done

Royalsreview_tiny by royalsreview on in News

Jenn Sterger's covering the Trade Deadline for SI.com, right? Think of how effective she'd be as an inside information gatherer...

I'll keep this updated as news does or doesn't roll in. Will this trade deadline be the snore-fest many have predicted, or, as Tennyson said, will "some work of noble note, may yet be done"?

• Flanagan on Teahen's power outage.

• Rob Neyer will be chatting at ESPN at 12 ET.

• Rosenthal's latest includes no new news on Dotel, but does mention that Troy Glaus could be on the block.

• Will Carroll had this to say about the Dotel-Davies trade, the one that some people have referred to as done (as in completed) while others feel its distant:

A couple of days ago, Octavio Dotel was thought to be one of the top available relievers. Now, he's going to be dealt in a secondary deal made for Kyle Davies, a guy that the Braves coaching staff had lost faith in. How did Dotel's value drop--or did it? The Indians had their offer on the table (thought to be Ben Francisco), and the Tigers never seemed to jump in. The Dodgers haven't been able to do much of anything because of arguments about who's untouchable and who isn't within that organization. Royals GM Dayton Moore knows Kyle Davies from his days in the Braves organization, and that familiarity plus Davies' upside made this deal happen.

• AJC on the Dotel-Davies rumor. Davies stats here.

• According to the Seattle PI, the Dotel-Davies deal is done, only official announcement is being delayed until the Teixeira deal goes final.

• The Cleveland Plain Dealer isn't giving up the ghost that the Tribe still remains interested in Dotel. According to the PD, Detroit is also a player.

• One odd slightly interesting thing about Davies, he's actually named "Hiram Kyle Davies", but appears to be known exclusively as Kyle. I'm shocked that someone growing up in Georgia and employed in baseball would drop Hiram.

Update [2007-7-31 13:45:59 by royalsreview]:

Jayon Stark reports that the Dotel-Davies trade is finalized, still just waiting on the Tex trade to go through.

******

Update [2007-7-31 14:51:3 by royalsreview]:

Jayson Stark has reported on ESPN's TV special that Dotel-Davies is done, final, official, and everything else.

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A depressing trade deadline, no doubt.
I guess we will find out what, if anything, has happened in a matter of hours.  I can only hope the Balentien offer by Seattle was a real one, or failing that, that some GM panics and ups his offer for Dotel.

Davies certainly doesn't excite me, but now that we can count down the number of minutes to the deadline, I'm more and more willing to settle for the package offered by Atlanta.  The birds of fortuity no longer seem alight on our shoulders.

by marbotty on Jul 31, 2007 10:46 AM EDT   0 recs

What did you think we were going to get?
Did you think all of the prospects talked about were actually going to be offered?  Did you think we were going to get Gutierrez, Kemp, Loney, Laroche?

There was never any reason to believe that the Royals were going to get a good, young major leaguer or a top prospect.  Dotel is a closer and none of the potential trade partners need a closer.  They just needed a setup man.  They are only looking for an additional good arm for their bullpens.  And Dotel is good, but not great.  Dotel is also frequently injured and he might go down at any moment.  And, of course, he's a 2-month rental.  All of this affects his trade value.

We will still probably get either Davies or Balentein.  Both are pretty good young prospects with uneven track records.  I'd be happy to get either one.  We should all be happy to get either one.

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 10:54 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I'd be ecstatic if we got Balentien
I consider him a great deal for Dotel.  I don't see it happening.  

I never expected Loney or Kemp, but I thought Gutierrez or LaRoche were options.  We may have to toss in a minor leaguer, as well, but I'd be okay with that.  

I don't think my expectations were unrealistic -- I just don't think we're going to get much of anything now.

by marbotty on Jul 31, 2007 11:02 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

let me also say the Linebrink deal
got me very excited.  

He's better than Dotel, although not incredibly so, and additionally he doesn't have the Established Closer credentials which makes some GMs salivate.

by marbotty on Jul 31, 2007 11:04 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

What we're going to get...
...is the best offer Moore receives.  No one should be surprised that he wasn't offered Gutierrez or Laroche.  Dotel is a frequently injured pretty good closer, and that's it.  Young, very good players are just too valuable.

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 11:04 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I agree...
when you figure that Dotel is a two month rent-a-player, has a history of injuries, has never been a good closer until this year (and isn't exactly setting the league on fire), then getting a 23 year old pitcher that has some stuff sounds pretty good to me. We were not going to get a #1 prospect for him, nor a 2, a 3, etc.

by nkkc on Jul 31, 2007 11:22 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I was wondering this myself...
I think Grudz, Sanders, and Brown will all stay (unfortunately).
"I DARE you to make less sense."

by dejackso on Jul 31, 2007 10:54 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

How many non-Dotel Royals?
At this point, I'm going to guess zero.

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 10:54 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Excellent question
Grudz is likely staying put, Sanders has got to be a somewhat unattractive target to most teams (I believe the Dye trade ended the chances of him going to the Red Sox, which was probably his only possible destination), which really only leaves Greinke, Riske, and perhaps Brown as potential tradees.  

I don't see Moore parting with Greinke.  Brown might be a good option for some teams, except he's failed to have his typical hot second half this year.  So, that really leaves Riske, and I believe there was some rumblings yesterday that he might be headed to Atlanta for Thorman.  

Am I missing anyone?

by marbotty on Jul 31, 2007 10:58 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Grud and LaLa I guess
I dont think a Teahen trade is unthinkable, but I dunno who'd want him...

by royalsreview on Jul 31, 2007 11:00 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

As a center field option
perhaps.  If the power comes back he's like a Sizemore type, if not he's more than adequate for the position.  Florida would be the ideal trading partner.  

by lordbyronk on Jul 31, 2007 11:05 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I don't know what other people think...
but I would be bummed if we got rid of Greinke for anyone.  My opinion is purely from an emotional fanboy perspective, though.  I just think he's the coolest player in the league and completely insane.
"I DARE you to make less sense."

by dejackso on Jul 31, 2007 11:00 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm with you
Not sure I agree with the insanity charge, but I certainly share the fanboy love.

by marbotty on Jul 31, 2007 11:05 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Hehe
I don't know, dude.  That slow batting practice ball he throws sometimes makes me wonder about the insanity.  It's a good insanity, though...that kind of closer insanity that baseball writers like to make up.
"I DARE you to make less sense."

by dejackso on Jul 31, 2007 11:08 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I just want to
see him start talking to the ball like the crazy pitcher from along time ago, Byrdch or something like that.  I think he has completely lost his mind but I don't care as long as he throws strikes.

by TXroyal on Jul 31, 2007 11:13 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Before my time, but...
Fidrych was amusing.
"I DARE you to make less sense."

by dejackso on Jul 31, 2007 11:14 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Before my time also
I'm only 24 but I read about him not to long ago in a SI article.

by TXroyal on Jul 31, 2007 11:21 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

If you watch ESPN Classic...
they'll show him every so often.  
"I DARE you to make less sense."

by dejackso on Jul 31, 2007 11:25 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I completely agree
I think he should also try throwing his eefus pitch, or what ever its called, every once in a while.  It worked when he was a starter and now that he is throwing harder it would work even better.  Also its pretty funny when batters get all out of position trying to slow themselves down to hit it after expecting a fastball.

by TXroyal on Jul 31, 2007 11:07 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Kyle Davies?
Seriously, why? This dude sucks in the National League. I hope this is a bluff and Dayton just told some GM, "Oh, yeah. Well, I'll just deal him for Kyle Davies." With all of the names I've heard thrown around for Dotel, this one doesn't excite me. If this deal goes down straight up, Dayton will start being known as Shurholtz bitch. I'll reserve judgement until the deal is done. I refuse to believe that Dayton will make this deal. He's smarter than that, isn't he?

by royaldaddy on Jul 31, 2007 10:54 AM EDT   0 recs

Only if you believe this is a dumb deal...
which most don't.  Let's not forget he's a 23 year old pitcher...and very, very, very few pitchers are good at 23.
"I DARE you to make less sense."

by dejackso on Jul 31, 2007 10:56 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

hard to judge since we don't know what the
other offers were

but yea, Davies is lame

then again, i thought the same about banny

What hath Bell wrought?

by FireBell on Jul 31, 2007 10:56 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Reserve judgment
If we get Davies, I think you should reserve judgment until Davies pitches for the Royals for a while.

Moore and his crew have done a great job of scouting pitchers and picking up good pitchers that no one else thought was especially good (Meche, Bannister, Soria, and to a lesser extent De La Rosa).  A track record like that has built up a lot of trust in me.  Shouldn't it?

Davies has 3 very good pitches.  And he's still just 23.  He was clearly rushed to the majors.  There is a reason why the cynics at Rotoworld said this sounds like a good deal for the Royals.

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 10:57 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I agree completely
Dotel for Davies sounds like a trade for the sake of making a trade.  I've seen better closers than Dotel, but the last thing the Royals need is another lousy young pitcher.  This organization has been plagued by lousy young pitchers (see Lumsden, etc.).

by jbrocato on Jul 31, 2007 2:39 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Another lousy young pitcher
like Bannister or Soria.  What is Moore thinking???

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 2:41 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Bannister and Soria didn't have 6.15 career ERAs
Wasn't Bannister a decent pitcher for the Mets before getting hurt?

Rule V players like Soria are zero-risk; that's not trading a proven closer for a player with a 6+ career ERA (in the NL, at that).

by jbrocato on Jul 31, 2007 2:46 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Davies has a lot of talent
And Moore and his scouts have done a great job of identifying pitching talent that others thought wasn't so great.  He has earned my trust.  If he really likes Davies, so do I.

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 2:49 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Davies is no Bannister
I don't think a 6.15 ERA is misleading.  It's not like he was with the Rockies.

Davies is the type of pitcher I would enjoy seeing shelled every fifth day for the Cardinals.

by jbrocato on Jul 31, 2007 2:53 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I think Moore, his front office and his scouts
...know more about Davies than either you or I do.  All you know about him is his stats.  And, by the way, those are major league stats from age 22 and 23.  I trust Moore on pitchers.  I think you should too.  Moore's track record should mean something.

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 2:55 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Moore's track record????
This is the GM who traded MacDougal for two scrubs, one of whom has a 6+ ERA in AAA.

This is another case of the Royals getting burned at the trade deadline.  First, Herk Robinson was taken to the cleaners, followed by Allard Baird, now Moore is just as gullible.

by jbrocato on Jul 31, 2007 2:58 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Yes, Moore's track record
Meche signing
Soria pick up
Bannister trade

And you didn't like the Macdougal trade?  Have you seen his stats this year?  You might want to look them up.  You also might want to note that he's on the DL...again.

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 3:01 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I think Davies' MLB stats speak for themselves
I don't really care if he can get hitters out in Burlington.

by jbrocato on Jul 31, 2007 2:59 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Besides...
ERA is pretty meaningless when all the rest of his stats are above average to pretty darn good.  Its pretty silly to judge Davies as a failure at his age.  This is a good move.
"I DARE you to make less sense."

by dejackso on Jul 31, 2007 2:59 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Not saying Davies is any of these guys, but...
Greg Maddux, ERA, first two years: 5.52, 5.61

Roy Halladay, cumulative ERA first three years: 5.77, including an Elarton-esque 4-7, 10.64 in 2000

Johan Santana, 6.49 ERA in 30 games his first year

Early returns aren't always definitive on pitching prospects.

by andrewmiller on Jul 31, 2007 2:58 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

They all stunk!
Those stats speak for themselves.

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 3:02 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Does Flanagan read this site?
Seriously, his last two columns have been straight off RR topics: Buck's playing time and Teahen's lack of power. Whats next, a feature on Bell's multiple lineups?
What hath Bell wrought?

by FireBell on Jul 31, 2007 10:55 AM EDT   0 recs

I don't think
...he's stupid enough to write a column about something as meaningless as Bell's use of multiple lineups.

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 10:58 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

here comes the pitch, its a hanging curve
[insert joke about Flanagan being dumb enough to write about _ here]

"Flanagan has been dumb enough to write about KC radio gossip and ratings for years now"

by LeoBloom on Jul 31, 2007 11:01 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

i actually like flanagan...
he's like a solid utility player.  nothing spectacular, but lots of singles.  i read him every day, so that's saying something.

by Billex Gordler on Jul 31, 2007 12:32 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Baseball Prospectus
is saying that the trade has happened this morning, but MLBtraderumors saying negative last night.  Any word one way or another?  

by lordbyronk on Jul 31, 2007 10:57 AM EDT   0 recs

As far as I know...
it's not final yet.
"I DARE you to make less sense."

by dejackso on Jul 31, 2007 10:58 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

BP has no inside nknowledge here
It appears they are reacting to last night's stories which said the deal was all but done.  There is more recent information out there which makes the deal look much more fuzzy.

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 11:00 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

not totally true
Carroll is pretty connected

by LeoBloom on Jul 31, 2007 11:02 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm not saying BP doesn't know anything
But in today's Dotel reporting, they are reporting no new information.  They are just reporting generally on Dotel-Davies.

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 11:05 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

2 maybe 3
I think they can get rid of Larue to either LAA or Atlanta. Also I think somebody will pick up either Sanders or Perez.  Also this is wishful thinking b/c I don't want to see any of them in uniform for the game tonight.

by TXroyal on Jul 31, 2007 10:58 AM EDT   0 recs

I might have to run around town naked...
if LaRue is gone.  That would be awesome.  Probably not going to happen though.
"I DARE you to make less sense."

by dejackso on Jul 31, 2007 10:59 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

i don't know how he could get traded
unless it's as a throw in on another deal.

by marbotty on Jul 31, 2007 11:18 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I can think of a few ways...
  1. The devil makes a GM do it
  2. Mafia puts some pressure on a GM
  3. Alien probing technology damages a GM's brain
  4. LaRue has some "pictures" of a GM
"I DARE you to make less sense."

by dejackso on Jul 31, 2007 11:20 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

just think of it...
without LaRue, they call up Phillips, allowing for an amazing amount of new lineup possibilities, more grit, and Buck still only playing 60% of the time due to "finding out what we have with Phillips." I can harldy wait.

by nkkc on Jul 31, 2007 11:26 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I have faith in Buddy...
to never play a grit-less Phillips
"I DARE you to make less sense."

by dejackso on Jul 31, 2007 11:26 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Hmm
6) Larue discovers the cure for cancer, and all the teams want him for the publicity.
"I DARE you to make less sense."

by dejackso on Jul 31, 2007 11:28 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Atlanta?
Any word on what Atlanta is doing about a backup catcher? Any possibility if the Dotel-Davies trade goes through that we could throw in LaRue for some minor leaguer?

by SLUGERRR on Jul 31, 2007 12:16 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Davies for Dotel
Definitely a bit of a downer if that's the case. I didn't think we were getting a blue-chipper for him, but Kyle Davies?
A mind without purpose will walk in dark places.

by NHZ on Jul 31, 2007 11:52 AM EDT   0 recs

Rushed pitching prospect
Clearly he wasn't ready for the majors at 21, 22 or 23.  But that's still quite young for a pitching prospect with very good stuff.  I like his 3 very good pitches.  And we could use some starting pitching depth.

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 11:54 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

young pitchers are like second wives
when theres nothing else good to say, you can always fall back on "well, he is 23"
I have Morgellons.

by DyeFan187 on Jul 31, 2007 11:54 AM EDT   0 recs

And there is much more to say about Davies
Read anything about him?  He's got a lot of talent.  Three very good pitches.  Excellent control of his fastball.

But Balentein finally has one good minor league season and everyone is fawning over him.  

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 11:56 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

agreed
personally, i dont have high expectations for the Dotel swag, nor do I think I should have

he's an old, injury-prone Proven Closer who's available for 50+ games

the fact that the braves think Davies fits that bill tells me mostly all i need to know

I have Morgellons.

by DyeFan187 on Jul 31, 2007 11:59 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Jenn Sterger would pique my interest anytime
Especially if the article or report included a full shot of her... heh, heh.

On a serious note, I love the fact that GMDM is using a sell-high vet to acquire young pitching talent.

May the Royals keep wisely stock-piling potential arms for the near future.

by KC Blue on Jul 31, 2007 11:57 AM EDT   0 recs

Scouting Notebook 2005
on young Mr. Kyle Davies

"After doing things his way during his first two years in the Atlanta farm system, Davies decided to take the Braves' advice and alter the mechanics of his delivery prior to the 2003 slate.  He overcame some inital awkwardness to put together a solid showing before dominating at every step of the 2004 campaign.

Davies is one of the fiercest competitors in the minors.  His changeup rates as the best in the Atlanta system, and his hard fastball, which has increased in velocity from 86-87mph to 92-93mph since revamping his mechanics, can be overpowering.

Davies' command has made significant strides of late and the consistency of his slider will determine how soon he is pitching in Atlanta."

He's either a gem or a right handed Odalis Perez.

by howserfan on Jul 31, 2007 11:58 AM EDT   0 recs

or Cliff Lee...
a guy who's alternatively "fiery" but also borderline an uncoachable pratt with a temper
I have Morgellons.

by DyeFan187 on Jul 31, 2007 12:00 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

or Brian Bannister
with better stuff.

Who knows.  I'm not saying this guy is going to be a good major league starter.  Like all 23-year-old baseball players, he's a maybe.  He might fall on his face.  Or he could develop into something goog, or mediocre, or inconsistent.  But he definitely has real upside potential.

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 12:02 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

One analyst's opinion (from BP)
On a potential Davies-Dotel trade:

Christina Kahrl : I don't think we need to get overly worked up over whether or not Octavio Dotel's stock has fallen or risen--keep your eye on the player, not the stage. He's the sixth-best Royals reliever this season, and more of an ex-famous person than the guy who handed Billy Wagner leads. For the Royals, this was a well-excecuted single-season rental for a player whose 2008 option (effectively mutual, since his team can nix his exercising his player option) they should have had zero interest in exercising. The timing would be impeccable, as Dotel's only just about to start getting into his appearances bonuses, which might bring him another million dollars or so this season. Four or five years of Davies under control, and what that could be worth, represents an excellent pay-off, but not to rip on the Braves, it was also a price they could afford to pay, given the amount of young pitching coming up in their system, and their obvious frustration with Davies.

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 11:59 AM EDT   0 recs

ding ding ding
I think the issue of how long Davies will be cheap and under Royal control is the real key here

by royalsreview on Jul 31, 2007 12:02 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I agree... with the cheapness...
Small Market teams have to look for bargains.  Davies may just be this year's bargain basement trade gem.  Bring him on....

by grudz69 on Jul 31, 2007 12:07 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Isn't it about time a final decision was made?
If I were Moore right now, I'd say, "John, it's time to shit or get off the pot.  Finalize this deal now or I'm going with Seattle and taking that kid with the weird last name."

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 12:08 PM EDT   0 recs

I think my girlfriend is getting pissed...
at me for staying on the computer waiting for the trade deadline to end.  
"I DARE you to make less sense."

by dejackso on Jul 31, 2007 12:12 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

i think its 4
What hath Bell wrought?

by FireBell on Jul 31, 2007 12:13 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Trade Deadline
I saw some where that is was 3:00 PM EST but I'm pretty sure it is 4:00 PM EST.
Scott Elarton gives that short kid with no athletic ability hope that he can make it big some day.

by MileHighKCfan on Jul 31, 2007 12:14 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I hope we keep Dotel and
lock him up for a few years if Dayton doesn't get what he wants. The bullpen is stacked.

by RTC Fan on Jul 31, 2007 12:11 PM EDT   0 recs

Multi-year extension for Dotel?
That's wasted money.  He is injured most of the time.  We'd get very little for our money.  I'd much rather get a B prospect who is cheap and might actually turn into something.

by NYRoyal on Jul 31, 2007 12:13 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm with you, RTC....
but I think we're alone on this one.

by natemaestro on Jul 31, 2007 12:18 PM EDT to parent up